Welcome Msg: Welcome index futures traders and TrendVUE.com alumni. Today's charts at www.DaCharts.com WARNING: Any trades posted here are for educational purposes only. Don't take the trades unless you understand them and can take the risk. Paltalk: Subscribe to Paltalk Plus to stop the popups today! Get it NOW for less than THREE CENTS a day! Click HELP on your Pal List then click 'Bannerless PalTalk'. Paltalk: Please visit our advertisers by clicking on banners. (08:55 AM) elly_34: good morning Paltalk: Your friends are just a click away! Press the invite button NOW! (09:00 AM) x21r: good morning (09:01 AM) ann_87: gm all (09:03 AM) hanksterr: gm all (09:04 AM) hanksterr: dave, retro stats look great, but are there two entries missing (09:05 AM) dave_b_quik: hank, i've only been around in the mornings, and haven't had time to reconstruct the afternoon trades. If you have them, send them to me and I'll add them (09:21 AM) Orprepus: totmty (09:21 AM) hanksterr: sorry dave, my data does not seem to match your charts, I need to see your charts. Paltalk: Go bannerless and support PalTalk! Subscribe today! Only $9.95 a year! Click HELP on your Pal List then click 'Bannerless PalTalk'. (09:35 AM) ppusa: i think it's tiime for retro to trend? (09:35 AM) dave_b_quik: that would be nice (09:36 AM) BrainStorm: Morning (09:38 AM) dave_b_quik: gm (09:41 AM) jimbo_320: gm all (09:42 AM) QSuzy: hi everyone.... (09:44 AM) david h_2: why did ibm gap down? (09:44 AM) ppusa: selling (09:44 AM) ppusa: motorola maybe? (09:46 AM) ann_87: trin dropping alot (09:46 AM) ann_87: .73 now (09:46 AM) ppusa: retro in? (09:47 AM) jimbo_320: y big trin move (09:47 AM) ppusa: obot here (09:47 AM) Buffy_04364: falling trin falling risk for longs - do I remember that right? (09:47 AM) ann_87: trin .61 (09:47 AM) Buffy_04364: tks ann (09:48 AM) ann_87: shows buying (09:48 AM) Buffy_04364: yep (09:48 AM) dave_b_quik: ppusa, with the 20ema trend rule retro had to pass on this long (09:48 AM) ann_87: in this case alot (09:48 AM) Buffy_04364: so doesn't the ticki (09:48 AM) ppusa: guess not (09:49 AM) jimbo_320: 800 ticks (09:49 AM) ppusa: Dave i am surprised because was beneath ma's when nq started up (09:50 AM) ppusa: also action suggested room on the upside. (09:50 AM) ppusa: go put in HOD (09:50 AM) ppusa: not to mention may be LOD (09:51 AM) dave_b_quik: price has to close above 20EMA5 for retro to go long on the first 15m breakout (09:51 AM) ppusa: i bot 46.5 but pushed scalp button by mistake (09:52 AM) ppusa: PnF geting a lot of buy sigs, the type that look like LOD is in (09:52 AM) ann_87: good example of 2b test of range (09:53 AM) ann_87: 933 ticks (09:53 AM) ppusa: shoot and i thought retro would trend today too (09:54 AM) dave_b_quik: it's still early (09:55 AM) ann_87: sp tests yest high (09:56 AM) ann_87: dow too (09:57 AM) ppusa: HOD or LOD, take your pick Paltalk: Please support our sponsors by clicking on banners. (09:58 AM) jimbo_320: 65 is es R1 (09:58 AM) ppusa: lookiing for a short to reverse PnF but don't yet know where (09:58 AM) ppusa: maybe missed it (10:03 AM) ppusa: #$%$$^%$$# (10:03 AM) jimbo_320: out es +6 (10:04 AM) jimbo_320: 70 is R2 (10:05 AM) pete77_1: ES went right through stong divergence (10:06 AM) jimbo_320: might be getting back in here... (10:10 AM) BrainStorm: looking to too jimbo (10:11 AM) ann_87: IB 5 min (10:24 AM) ppusa: after yesterday today's action no surprise (10:24 AM) BrainStorm: Back in Jimbo ? didnt take it here (10:24 AM) ppusa: 15 point PnF could use reversal (10:25 AM) ppusa: not to badly overextended but due (10:26 AM) ann_87: IB 5 min (10:27 AM) jimbo_320: 3 legs up on es Paltalk: Are banners a bummer and popups a pain? Cure your banner blues NOW for $9.95 a year! Click HELP on your Pal List then select Bannerless PalTalk to subscribe now! No banners! No Popups! Fast video in all groups! (10:28 AM) ppusa: maybe one more high then pb??? (10:28 AM) jimbo_320: bs y but watching close (10:28 AM) ppusa: or retest or ??? 10 point PnF has reversed so looks like could have another leg (10:30 AM) jimbo_320: havent had vol spike to indicate top yet (10:31 AM) ppusa: other markets have higher highs than yester so nq should too??? (10:31 AM) jimbo_320: could see es 80 here if we can take 70 (10:35 AM) skyprince_1: Rolling 2B's (10:35 AM) jimbo_320: nq is stalling at downtrend line on 30 min (10:36 AM) skyprince_1: And yesterday's HOD (10:36 AM) jimbo_320: out half +1.5 be rest (10:36 AM) jimbo_320: on the rest (10:41 AM) ppusa: another 10 point reversal (10:41 AM) ppusa: still no 15 (10:42 AM) BrainStorm: light volume (10:44 AM) ppusa: PnF pattern looks like wants to get 15 here, reverse into sell signals (10:44 AM) ppusa: from lots of buy sigs (10:45 AM) ppusa: but if it does, buy the drop for a new high or are markets going to reverse down??? (10:46 AM) ppusa: may sit on hands for awhile (10:48 AM) eemb: hi x21r (10:49 AM) ann_87: 30 tiki (10:52 AM) BrainStorm: ES stronger than NQ (10:52 AM) ppusa: Dave, re: trade this AM, when price below all ma's should get tretro buy? (10:53 AM) jimbo_320: posted es 30 min chart summary (10:54 AM) BrainStorm: Im a bit unsure what use the MAs are on the first bar (10:54 AM) skyprince_1: Retro doesn't have an MA rule, right? (10:54 AM) ppusa: 20 ema rule (10:55 AM) jimbo_320: go es go (10:55 AM) BrainStorm: some people have an MA filter on trades (10:55 AM) dave_b_quik: on first retro trade, price below 20EMA is being used to indicate downtrend, so no long, however, the open was a 2B reversal on the 5m, so changes trend to up... (10:55 AM) ppusa: 2B or @T? (10:55 AM) ppusa: 2T (10:55 AM) skyprince_1: MA rule this AM would have kept you out of a 25 pt run in retro (NQ). (10:56 AM) BrainStorm: 20ema is pretty meaningles untill you have had 20 bars? (10:56 AM) dave_b_quik: it was a 2B test of the last swing low from yesterday... (what's a 2T?) (10:56 AM) BrainStorm: night session and yesterdays session are not that useful ? (10:57 AM) ppusa: obviously rule has worked so far so maybe not jump all over it. But when price below all ma's maybe ok (10:57 AM) BrainStorm: gap down will leave you below the MAA but strong possibility that the gap will fill on the first trend (10:57 AM) dave_b_quik: true Paltalk: Multivideo has been activated in all Paltalk groups!!! With Paltalk 4.0 (available from our beta link on our homepage), you can see up to three people in every group. Paltalk Plus subscribers can see people in full motion video. (10:58 AM) jimbo_320: grind up (10:58 AM) BrainStorm: Not sure how 'official' the rule is..wasnt it introduced 2 weeks ago in chat ? (10:59 AM) QSuzy: Dave.....if we get a downbar on 5min, we will have a lower hi.....would you start looking for a short on the 15min or would you wait for close below 20ema5? (10:59 AM) dave_b_quik: the trend filter for the first trade goes back quite a while (10:59 AM) BrainStorm: Ahh OK I need to understand that better then (10:59 AM) dave_b_quik: we've only been using the 20EMA5 on the first trade (10:59 AM) QSuzy: okay....tx (11:00 AM) BrainStorm: Instninct says it may be detrimental because of the gap situation (11:00 AM) dave_b_quik: that rule was the result of a lot of failures on the first trade during light summer action (11:00 AM) BrainStorm: sure (11:00 AM) dave_b_quik: may have been a case of over-optimizing (11:00 AM) jimbo_320: out es +5.5, +11.5, :-) on day, taking a break (11:00 AM) BrainStorm: well done jimbo (11:01 AM) jimbo_320: done in 90 minutes :-) (11:01 AM) skyprince_1: Hmmmm...IB on 15M (11:01 AM) BrainStorm: so if you gap down that is likely to rule out long trades? (11:02 AM) dave_b_quik: ya, with the 20EMA filter, but remember that all the rules are subject to change after further testing (11:02 AM) ppusa: so maybe we can watch and if below all ma's can alter rule for that exception. inbetween ma's, rule should work (11:02 AM) dbphoenix: What is "IB", sky? (11:02 AM) BrainStorm: Sure understand its a work in progress (11:03 AM) ppusa: inside (11:03 AM) ppusa: bar (11:03 AM) skyprince_1: yes (11:03 AM) BrainStorm: being devils advocate is easier in many ways too :-) (11:03 AM) dbphoenix: I need more caffeine. (11:04 AM) skyprince_1: db.....go to SBUX...I'm long it...a bunch! (11:07 AM) BrainStorm: Early you quite often get an early swing in one direction with the 'main' trend following in the oposite direction. I guess what is needed is some way to make sure that you dont get faked by the former (11:07 AM) dbphoenix: 2Bs on 1m and 3m, NQ. (11:07 AM) ppusa: BS that is reason for rule (11:08 AM) dbphoenix: Problem is determining the "main" trend. Depends on the timeframe. We still have lower highs and lower lows in larger timeframes, higher highs and higher lows today. (11:08 AM) ppusa: but when price is below all ma's usually resulting move is good reversal of trend (11:10 AM) dbphoenix: Maybe within that timeframe. But when one starts mixing timeframes, it's real easy to get stuck trading countertrend. (11:10 AM) skyprince_1: KISS--keep it simple, stupid..:) (11:12 AM) BrainStorm: This is largely intuition but I think it would be more effective making sure a bottom has been put in on lower time frame before going long and vice versa (11:12 AM) ppusa: dbp look at every chart from tick to hour and you will see TF was not a factor this AM (11:13 AM) ppusa: price below ma's on ALL charts (11:13 AM) dbphoenix: Sure it was. There was no support at 40 on any chart up to 60m (11:13 AM) ppusa: 15 and 16 revrersed (11:13 AM) dbphoenix: Being below MAs doesn't mean it's going up at any moment. (11:14 AM) ppusa: trading (11:15 AM) jimmer49: pp it is almost like you are speaking in code. Guess I'm going to have to get into Pnf so I can understand. (11:15 AM) dbphoenix: If we had reached the bottom of the range this am, I would have had more confidence in going long. But 40 is not a demonstrated low. (11:15 AM) ppusa: that combined with retro signal (11:16 AM) ppusa: last week i sasid 29.5 should hold (11:16 AM) dbphoenix: What retro signal? (11:16 AM) ppusa: break of 15 minute bar (11:16 AM) dbphoenix: Didn't Dave just say that that's not a signal if the bar is below the MAs? (11:17 AM) ppusa: 20 ema (11:17 AM) ppusa: and all i am saying is (11:17 AM) ppusa: IF (11:18 AM) dbphoenix: Yes, he said that first bar was not a signal today. (11:18 AM) ppusa: price is below ALL ma's (11:18 AM) ppusa: maybe signal should be taken (11:18 AM) ppusa: because this means (11:18 AM) ppusa: that (11:18 AM) ppusa: price is below the current HOD (11:19 AM) ppusa: and therefore (11:19 AM) dbphoenix: If price were below all MAs, it would most likely be in a a downtrend, in which case going long would be entering countertrend. (11:19 AM) dave_b_quik: db, the 20EMA5 down trend indication was over ridden by the 5m 2B reversal at open (11:19 AM) ppusa: a run to HOD would be expected (11:19 AM) ann_87: i think Dave said was a buy (11:19 AM) ppusa: yes dbp, but have you ever bought anything at the bottom? (11:20 AM) dbphoenix: No. (11:20 AM) dbphoenix: Don't know anyone who ever did. (11:20 AM) ppusa: well i rather enjoy doing that now and then (11:20 AM) ppusa: bot this am 46.5 (11:21 AM) dave_b_quik: nice job, ppusa (11:21 AM) ppusa: reason because it was a @%$^%#$&$& obvioyus buy!!! (11:21 AM) ann_87: mike first cross on 5 min (11:22 AM) ppusa: so let's just watch the rule and if it pans out fine, if not forget it (11:22 AM) ann_87: db.... seems that 40 was a good test of a RANGE , no true trend going on (11:22 AM) ann_87: yesterday was an inside day in nq (11:22 AM) ppusa: Dave, i have another question. You referred to a 2B on the 5 minute. Was the 2B actually a break of the top at 1247? (11:22 AM) dbphoenix: Missed your buy, pp. Thought you were sitting on your hands. (11:22 AM) ppusa: scroll back (11:22 AM) ann_87: sorry narrow range (11:23 AM) dbphoenix: Depends on how you define range, Ann. What timeframe? (11:23 AM) dave_b_quik: ya, ppusa, on the NQ 5m that was a test of the swing low from yd at 1245.50 (11:23 AM) ann_87: 15 min (11:24 AM) ann_87: even 5 min adx real low (11:25 AM) ann_87: IB nq 5 min (11:25 AM) BrainStorm: looks well set up for a strong trend day soon (11:26 AM) ppusa: Dave. sometimes when you say 2B, i think you mean 2T but refer to the rule as the 2B rule...is this correct? (11:26 AM) BrainStorm: pennant on the daily (or is it a flag I get them muddled) congestion areas all over the place (11:26 AM) dave_b_quik: ppusa, did you tell me what a 2T is? (11:27 AM) ppusa: ????2T double top which in this last case was 47.5 before nq ran through it (11:27 AM) skyprince_1: 2T?? I'm just getting 2B and 1-2-3 down. Help! (11:28 AM) ppusa: but you refer to this break (I think ) as the 2B reversal? Paltalk: Click banners to visit our sponsors. (11:28 AM) dave_b_quik: OK, ppusa. no, when i say 2B i'm using trader vic's definition of a test of top or bottom with penetration of the previous swing and then reversal (11:29 AM) donsuelo: Other than the obvious, is there a definition for a "strong trend day"? (11:30 AM) dave_b_quik: 2B could be a test of a major top, bottom, or any other significant level (11:30 AM) ann_87: minus 170 ticks hmm (11:30 AM) ppusa: okay Dave, i think i understand. tks (11:30 AM) skyprince_1: Breaking a 2T, heading for 2B in the 1-2-3...let's rock! Waaaa.....music please? Where's our guitarist? (11:30 AM) dave_b_quik: LOL (11:31 AM) ppusa: haha (11:32 AM) ppusa: Now jimmer, regarding PnF 15 and 16 (11:32 AM) MarkCA: Heading for a 2B? you mean a small retrace down and then higher? (11:32 AM) ann_87: IB 15 nq (11:32 AM) skyprince_1: Sucky volume...off to SBUX.... (11:33 AM) dave_b_quik: i think he was joking, mark (11:33 AM) ppusa: the PnF 10 point meaning a drop of ten points "reverses" the chart had enough legs up "reversals up" to where it looked like it was due for a leg down. (11:33 AM) MarkCA: thought so, but wasn't sure if I was missing something. (11:33 AM) skyprince_1: MArk..yes, just a little levity..I know nothing...don't listen to me! (11:34 AM) MarkCA: that's okay. But I sometimes have trouble telling when someone is joking, because I don't know enough to tell the difference. So I may ask from time to time !! (11:34 AM) ppusa: The leg down did occur after a 2T (thought i would throw that in) on the 10 point (11:35 AM) jimmer49: OK pp. Sometimes the way you say things it is just hard to tell where you are suggesting we are going next. (11:35 AM) dragonfly_37: can we call a 2T...DT???? (11:35 AM) skyprince_1: Good.....me too! Love retro though...doing well with it...(except yesterday :( (11:35 AM) jimmer49: I would have to have Pnf chat to get it I think. (11:35 AM) ppusa: and nq got the 15 point reversal as well as a 16 point reversal (drop) from the high of 1288,5 (11:37 AM) ppusa: Yes, this AM i said first that due for the reversal but not sure from where. Then as nq kept going higher and pulling back, thought it would happen from 88.5 which it did. But nq ran all the way back up to 88 after my call so still got the reversal, but a sloppy call. (11:38 AM) ppusa: or a good call and sloppy action (11:39 AM) jimmer49: Anyway, don't let me deter you. It is up to me to learn more about it. (11:39 AM) ppusa: now 1-2-3 think very good possibility of new nq high from here but don't know if i have guts to go long (11:40 AM) ppusa: may try long if break of 71 to complete 1-2-3 (11:41 AM) ppusa: don't trust markeets, still lower high than last wek and see no reason to be an aggressive buyer (11:42 AM) ppusa: move e from markeets and insert in wek (11:46 AM) skyprince_1: Creative writing pp? (11:47 AM) ppusa: y (11:47 AM) ppusa: took typing in 8th grade. Everyone in class passed 30 wpm except me (11:48 AM) ppusa: finally last test and only because by then i had memorized "The quick brown fox jumped over the lazy dawg" (11:48 AM) ppusa: whole class passed and we all got our pins (11:49 AM) skyprince_1: Hmmmm...tough deal...we all know typing prepares you for life, right? NOT! (11:50 AM) ppusa: look now with computers. If Mrs. Larsen had only known!!! (11:50 AM) dbphoenix: Actually, typing is the most useful course I ever took, sky :0) (11:51 AM) ppusa: :) (11:51 AM) ppusa: :-) (11:52 AM) ppusa: :-) (11:52 AM) skyprince_1: Oh my...all of a sudden...I feel so inadequate (as he hones his H&P skills). (11:53 AM) ppusa: H&P or HP? (11:53 AM) skyprince_1: Hunt and Peck..... (11:53 AM) ppusa: HP computer? (11:53 AM) jam_27: anybody long es? (11:53 AM) ppusa: sorry, haha (11:53 AM) ppusa: missed nq here (11:54 AM) ppusa: 2B at 71 haha (11:54 AM) ppusa: waited for break (11:54 AM) ppusa: waiting (11:54 AM) donsuelo: I attended the Hawaiin typing school "Whack a key" (11:54 AM) ppusa: looks good though (11:54 AM) skyprince_1: pp....so...it goes up (slowly), tests HOD again...and fails on low volume...IMO (11:55 AM) ppusa: i played whack a mole in Kona (11:55 AM) larrybf: can anyone here recommend a book that discusses in detail the pros and cons of different timeframes for daytrading? (11:55 AM) ppusa: all markeets outside up day but nq. gotta believe it will go (11:55 AM) dbphoenix: What that the one at Kamanaiwanalaya, donsuelo? (11:56 AM) donsuelo: 10-4 Danno (11:56 AM) BrainStorm: Any one long NQ here ? (11:56 AM) ppusa: Sky i wanted long for new high (11:56 AM) skyprince_1: yes....gl! (11:57 AM) dbphoenix: Larry, the ones I've seen invariably reflect the preference of the author, which never means much. You have to find the one that most represents your comfort level. (11:57 AM) ppusa: plus good to look at more than one Larry (11:57 AM) dbphoenix: For instance, if you use a 5m timeframe, you have more time to make a decision than if you're trying to ride a 1m. And even more time with a 15m. (11:57 AM) ppusa: imo Paltalk: Love PalTalk but hate the banners and popups? Go bannerless! Only $9.95 per year! Click HELP on your Pal List then click 'Bannerless PalTalk'. (11:58 AM) skyprince_1: Agree db..I have 45M, 15M, 5M, and 3M up...my fav. (11:58 AM) dbphoenix: Plus you'll see clear ranges in zones on some charts but not on others. These will provide targets for potential support and resistance tests. (11:59 AM) dbphoenix: However, once you've found your frame, you should maintain at least 1m, 5m, 10, and 15m charts running simultaneously so that you can see what's coming. (11:59 AM) larrybf: thanks db, but that is the problem.i love longer time frames on trend days but hate them on chop days which is the majority of time (11:59 AM) skyprince_1: db speaks the truth... (11:59 AM) BrainStorm: Some would say (Elder for example) that the bare minimum is a time frame aboav and below. he recommend roughly X5 relationship (12:00 PM) dbphoenix: For instance, the first 2b will show on the 1m, even tho it may not amount to anything. Buf if it results in a 2b on the 5, then you have reason to expect a 2b on the 10. And so on. (12:00 PM) larrybf: i use 1m, 3m, 9m and 15m but get confused which chart signal to focus on (12:01 PM) dbphoenix: I agree, BS. You could, for example, use 30m, 10m, 3m. (12:01 PM) BrainStorm: I think we all do larry (12:01 PM) ppusa: favorite saying "blend to the trend" (12:01 PM) dbphoenix: As to chop or trend, that's personal preference. Different risk profile, different skills, probably a different talent. (12:02 PM) larrybf: you are right BS. its like the search for the holy grail i suppose (12:02 PM) ppusa: long nq (12:02 PM) BrainStorm: try and be clear which you are trading (12:03 PM) dbphoenix: T, for example, says that most people shouldn't be trading within the range, but the range is partly defined by timeframe. On the 60m, for example, it's 1320 to 1225. (12:03 PM) BrainStorm: look a time frame higher for overall trend and try and take that direction go a time frame smaller to look for trouble up ahead (12:03 PM) dbphoenix: If you like that timeframe, then, you shouldn't be fiddling with it at all until it breaks out of that range. (12:04 PM) larrybf: thanks guys for the helpful insights (12:04 PM) BrainStorm: my problem is I sometimes ge wiggled out on the smaller time frame e.g. If Im trading 5 I might get wiggled out on a 1 min retracement ....poor discipline sometimes (12:05 PM) dbphoenix: The problem may also be this stop and start, stop and start. (12:06 PM) ann_87: sp new highs (12:06 PM) jimmer49: I think we must get used to this "stop and start" because it may just be th norm for a while. (12:07 PM) dbphoenix: In any case, it pays to keep an eye on the larger timeframe. Here, for instance, it shows a swing high at 1300-1320. Whether one wants to try for those few points or wait for a breakout above 1300-20 depends on what makes him sweat. (12:08 PM) donsuelo: Stop and start = No follow through of moves? (12:08 PM) jimbo_320: nice continuation up move (12:09 PM) ppusa: start trading es and dow, nq sucks (12:09 PM) BrainStorm: wish Id been on the ES today jimbo (12:09 PM) BrainStorm: maybe I'll watch both (12:09 PM) dbphoenix: Yes and no. It's called the "rule of alternation". You trend, then rest, then trend, then rest. (12:09 PM) jimmer49: es sure better today (12:09 PM) BrainStorm: might I ask where your first entry was Jimbo ? (12:09 PM) ppusa: needs something with less chop (12:10 PM) dbphoenix: What you do, though, depends on how strong the trend is and where you enter. Otherwise you may wind up entering at the turning point. (12:10 PM) BrainStorm: Ravenquote has a 'chopiness' indicator (12:10 PM) BrainStorm: never used it (12:10 PM) dbphoenix: T says that if you can't get more than two bars in either direction, you're in chop. Or you can use ADX if you like. (12:11 PM) dbphoenix: Look at the 15 and you'll see what I mean. (12:12 PM) BrainStorm: Joe Ross has some good mechanical ways of describing congestion which is pretty much the same (12:12 PM) dbphoenix: Days like this are troublesome for those who like going long on a downbar. Today you would have had to use the 1m to do so. (12:12 PM) jimbo_320: 63.5 (12:13 PM) dbphoenix: Or say a couple of Hail Marys and use retro. (12:13 PM) donsuelo: I've perfected the art of entering at the turnig point! Thanks all for the excellent thoughts I see what you mean db (12:13 PM) BrainStorm: e.g. on the 15 min chart all the bars are 'inside' the last up bar (NQ) (12:14 PM) BrainStorm: also we have up bar down bar up bar etc. (12:15 PM) jimbo_320: bought the first pullback on 3 min after the break of the downtrend line on the 30 min, signals on all charts on that one (12:16 PM) BrainStorm: Jimbo thanks where i guessed b/o of first retrace (12:16 PM) dbphoenix: I assume you bought before the bar finished forming. (12:17 PM) jimbo_320: i was watching the 1min as well (12:17 PM) BrainStorm: 15 min ES had a great entry a couple of bars ago too (12:18 PM) dbphoenix: That's another decision one has to make for himself. If one buys/sells before the bar finishes forming, he is essentially trading in the next lower timeframe. (12:19 PM) BrainStorm: not wishing to plunder all your trade secrets but might I ask where you place your initial stop on ES? fixed below the last 5 min bar ? (12:20 PM) jimbo_320: varies, no fixed size (12:20 PM) BrainStorm: Good point DB... I would add unless you are buying a BO of a previous bar in the time frame you are trading. Then no need to wait for the bar to form (12:21 PM) jimbo_320: depends on predicted reward (12:22 PM) jimbo_320: and setup (12:22 PM) BrainStorm: tragets based on pivots ? (12:23 PM) jimbo_320: y sometimes (12:24 PM) BrainStorm: It was unfortunate we did not get that pullback on the Nas...that life (12:28 PM) ann_87: dow almost test high of day Paltalk: Please support our sponsors by clicking on banners. (12:30 PM) dbphoenix: Buying BOs vs retracements is another choice one has to make, BS. (12:30 PM) jimbo_320: i am watching now as i dont see much upside past 80 (12:31 PM) ppusa: think nq may be ready now for new high...has 1-2 on 15 min (12:31 PM) ppusa: flat here (12:36 PM) ppusa: when it goes, it will go (12:37 PM) ppusa: key was buying the 2 on 15 min (12:37 PM) jimbo_320: are my charts screwy or did nq just jump 10point in 1min (12:37 PM) ppusa: bot again but out now (12:38 PM) ppusa: screwy (12:38 PM) ppusa: 10 points in 3 min (12:39 PM) ppusa: sounds like you had a little data feedproblem (12:39 PM) ann_87: pp what is a 1 2 on 15 min? (12:41 PM) jimbo_320: dow 9200 (12:41 PM) dbphoenix: He probably means the first two parts of a 1-2-3. (12:41 PM) jimbo_320: 0.56 trin (12:41 PM) dbphoenix: NQ crossed DTL, failed to make a lower low, now needs to break swing high. (12:42 PM) ann_87: thanks db (12:42 PM) dbphoenix: Which we seem to be doing now. (12:43 PM) ann_87: trin down to .52 at one pt here (12:43 PM) ann_87: yea i didn't understand the lingo of how we already had a 1 2 ? (12:44 PM) jimbo_320: sold 1/2 +2.25 (12:44 PM) ppusa: back 2 was 1277 on 15 minute chart (12:45 PM) ann_87: is that trader vic 2 pp? (12:45 PM) ppusa: no that is pp elliott wave (12:46 PM) ppusa: something is going to give up here. Either nq takes off, or Dow SP reverse (12:48 PM) ann_87: we could consolidate a bit... during lunch? and then continue trend? (12:48 PM) dbphoenix: Theoretically, we should continue. (12:48 PM) jimbo_320: take 80 could have big rally pm (12:48 PM) ann_87: i could not short that low trin (12:48 PM) ppusa: many times after 1-2-3, nq has pb (12:48 PM) BrainStorm: whats the MACD saying db anything of note ? (12:49 PM) ppusa: no shorts here (12:49 PM) dbphoenix: You'll have to ask Jimmer. He knows more about that than I do. (12:49 PM) ann_87: PP we don't have 1 2 3 ... we have 2b area here (12:50 PM) BrainStorm: oops getting confused doh (12:50 PM) ppusa: my count my way is 1-2-3 (12:51 PM) ppusa: if you would like to know how i do that, will be glad to tell (12:51 PM) ann_87: sure (12:51 PM) jimmer49: macd is not speaking to me at the moment (12:51 PM) BrainStorm: at a pivot on nq no (12:51 PM) BrainStorm: now (12:51 PM) dbphoenix: If you're talking about Sperandeo, Ann, you're correct. The 1-2-3 is failing. (12:52 PM) ann_87: i was speaking of sperandeo.... this being here a 2b (12:52 PM) dbphoenix: Not a 2b yet. (12:52 PM) ppusa: 1271 is bottom...1 is move to 1285.....2 is pullback to 1277 and 3 is move to new high (12:53 PM) ann_87: why is that db? (12:53 PM) ann_87: we took out high of day by a few ticks (12:53 PM) ann_87: thanks pp, ...for explaining (12:53 PM) donsuelo: Come on...2b or not 2b.that is the question (12:54 PM) BrainStorm: can you sing it to a waltz ? (12:54 PM) ppusa: now you can call that a pp1-2-3 (12:54 PM) ppusa: 123 123 123 123 (12:54 PM) ppusa: and yes, that is a waltz (12:55 PM) ppusa: 2b sounds like 2 step (12:55 PM) Orprepus: hey you stepped on my foot (12:55 PM) dragonfly_37: tks pp that's how I would also call a 123...but where would you buy (12:55 PM) ppusa: 2b 2b 2t2t 2b 2b 2t2t (12:55 PM) Orprepus: need more lesson Fred (12:55 PM) ann_87: db can you explain why that is not a 2b yet ? (12:56 PM) donsuelo: Send questions to POB 123 Vienna Austria Ask for the head sausage (12:56 PM) ppusa: slow slow quick quick (12:56 PM) ppusa: definately a 2 step (12:56 PM) Orprepus: lol (12:57 PM) Orprepus: now lets polka - everybody (12:57 PM) ppusa: dragonfly_37: but where would you buy 1277 would have been ideal (12:57 PM) ppusa: polka this up (12:58 PM) BrainStorm: volume tailed right off (12:58 PM) dbphoenix: Ann, there are multiple definitions of 1-2-3s and 2Bs floating around, so it's difficult to understand or be understood. (12:58 PM) ppusa: never mind (12:58 PM) Orprepus: indian summer rally Paltalk: Press the INVITE button NOW! Get your friends in on the fun! Invite them to join us on PalTalk today! (12:58 PM) dbphoenix: A 2B is a failure to make a new high or low, but the definition of "failure" varies from person to person. (12:58 PM) ann_87: true db, (12:59 PM) ann_87: db... you have taken t's class right? (12:59 PM) Orprepus: yeah to some people failure is success (12:59 PM) ann_87: the 2 b is making a new high (12:59 PM) dbphoenix: T uses the 20p as a criterion for failure. I use either that or the pullback low after the most recent high. (12:59 PM) donsuelo: I found the definition..looked up my name in the dictionary (12:59 PM) ann_87: and then failing (01:00 PM) dbphoenix: The main reason is that if the stock or index doesn't reach at least that level, then buyers won't be shaken out and they'll be more likely to come back in and drive it up. (01:01 PM) ppusa: regardless if you all want a trade, i have seen many cases where on 15 min nq gets the pp 1-2-3 as i described. I covered some of this in my chop talk awhile ago. So buying the 2 is your ticket to profits (01:01 PM) dragonfly_37: dp, what is the 20p?? (01:01 PM) dbphoenix: What is the "pp" 1-2-3? (01:01 PM) dragonfly_37: 20ema? (01:01 PM) dbphoenix: 20 period moving average (01:01 PM) ppusa: oh gee (01:01 PM) dbphoenix: Yes (01:01 PM) dragonfly_37: tks (01:02 PM) ppusa: exanple given dbp: 1271 is bottom...1 is move to 1285.....2 is pullback to 1277 and 3 is move to new high (01:02 PM) ann_87: db, i was trying to keep it simple and see what Teresa uses (01:02 PM) ann_87: on 2b's (01:03 PM) dbphoenix: I only spent a couple of weeks with her, but she used the 20p. (01:03 PM) donsuelo: How does theRoss 123 differ from the Sperandeo? (01:03 PM) ann_87: from my experience she would use a 5 mn bar that pokes to make a new high and if it came back below that she shorts there (01:03 PM) ppusa: Soomewhat obvious nq was going tomake a new high after pullback and 1-2-3 was setup (01:03 PM) dragonfly_37: pp, do you buy on the top of the 2 bar? and what time frame? (01:03 PM) ann_87: the 20 ema is first obj of the 2b (01:04 PM) dbphoenix: I never saw her short on a downbar. (01:04 PM) dragonfly_37: still trying to figure where your entry is (01:04 PM) BrainStorm: Ross is the easiest imho for a trend up reversing 1 would be high 2 pullback and 3 lower high (01:04 PM) ann_87: not a down bar (01:04 PM) ann_87: the low of bar that takes out the high of day (01:04 PM) ppusa: actually could buy the 2 which is bottom of pullback and then could add on break to upside (01:04 PM) BrainStorm: 1 2 3 are all swing high / swing low (01:05 PM) ppusa: most people here would buy the break to upside (01:05 PM) dbphoenix: Maybe it happened to coincide with the 20p. (01:05 PM) dragonfly_37: pp, how do you know if that is the bottom? (01:05 PM) ppusa: buying the pullback is something that you have to believe will go higher (01:05 PM) ann_87: no db, never (01:06 PM) ppusa: based on today's action (01:06 PM) ppusa: you just buy the bar that takes out the lows because that is my definition of a 2 (01:06 PM) dragonfly_37: yes, pp, but what indication do you personally use...sorry if I am hounding you for answers... (01:07 PM) ppusa: use for what? (01:07 PM) ppusa: to know it will go higher? (01:07 PM) ppusa: or to know where to buy? (01:07 PM) dbphoenix: Three different threads going on here. As to pp123, why not just call it EW 123 since you're using EW? (01:07 PM) dragonfly_37: you just answered my question, much tks (01:07 PM) dbphoenix: Ann, what do you mean by "never'? (01:08 PM) ann_87: when i did her classes, on all of T's 2b buys or sells, they were never based on the 20 ema (01:08 PM) ppusa: dbp because next time everyone will know exactly what i am referring to (01:08 PM) dbphoenix: Donsuelo, the Ross123 has to do with determining swings highs and lows, not necessarily trend change. (01:08 PM) dbphoenix: That's strange, Ann. When did you take them? (01:08 PM) ann_87: so i guess i mean , never when i took her class, the 20 ema was her 1st obj to take profits on the 2b (01:09 PM) ann_87: next obj is the box (01:09 PM) ppusa: besides pp1-2-3 sounds better (01:09 PM) ann_87: from April on.... many times (01:09 PM) donsuelo: Thans db (01:09 PM) dbphoenix: Interesting. (01:09 PM) ann_87: when did you take the class? (01:09 PM) ppusa: okay next lesson. I am looking for a 25 point drop (01:09 PM) ann_87: i also have the manual (01:10 PM) dbphoenix: Late August or early September. (01:10 PM) ppusa: where oh where can my 25 point drop be.? (01:10 PM) ann_87: db, maybe dave can help us here (01:10 PM) ann_87: he does 2b's all the time, and been with T a long time (01:13 PM) dbphoenix: According to the charts I have of hers, the 2B is defined by a failure of the pullback low. Otherwise, you're more likely to be scalping. If that's no longer the case, I'll have to ask her about it. (01:14 PM) ann_87: db, what chart? (01:15 PM) dbphoenix: The article she wrote on 2Bs. At the Yahoo site. (01:17 PM) ann_87: can you email it to me? (01:21 PM) skyprince_1: What's the Yahoo site? (01:22 PM) jimbo_320: 3rd 80 test (01:22 PM) dbphoenix: Here's the link: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ispec. It's called Tests of a Previous High or Low: The "Turrle" or the "2B". (01:22 PM) skyprince_1: thnks (01:22 PM) dbphoenix: However, defining a 2B is not the same as buying or shorting a test. (01:23 PM) dbphoenix: If she were stalking the 5m bars on a test of the most recent high, then her sell stop would be placed below the low of the last bar if there were six bars or less. But it wouldn't be defined as a 2B until there had been a failure. (01:24 PM) skyprince_1: ic (01:24 PM) dbphoenix: I guess you could call it shorting a potential 2B. (01:24 PM) ann_87: right always a potential (01:25 PM) ann_87: atleast to the 20 ema (01:25 PM) dbphoenix: But then she would look for buyers to come in at some level or other. (01:25 PM) ann_87: 20 ema (01:25 PM) dbphoenix: I think we're on the same wavelength. (01:25 PM) ann_87: great db (01:26 PM) ann_87: just wanted to feel like we all speak same language lol (01:26 PM) dbphoenix: I hate to speak for her. It's not as if we sit down for coffee every day, but I assume that she'd watch the 20p since so many people would think of that as a graille buy. (01:26 PM) ann_87: we already had had the grail buy... (01:27 PM) ann_87: on the sp etc (01:27 PM) ppusa: nq sure looks obot here (01:27 PM) dbphoenix: If the 20 then failed, those graille buyers would bolt and the index would clunk. (01:27 PM) ann_87: so the test was the grail buy test for es (01:28 PM) ann_87: for there to be a 2b of any kind she does want the adx rising showing a trend...so that was the area. of 2b , i think Paltalk: You DO have a choice! Buy bannerless to end your popup blues today! Click OPTIONS on your Pal List then click 'Bannerless PalTalk'. Only $9.95 a year! That's less than THREE CENTS per day! WOW!!! (01:31 PM) dbphoenix: I'd rather call something a test rather than a 2B until it actually fails. Otherwise, one is expecting something to happen. In other words, without the failure, a 2B isn't a 2B. Just like without a successful breakout, a cup with handle is a triple top. That is, it's only a cup with handle if it works. (01:33 PM) jimmer49: Sometimes I think it is possible to get too hung up on labels. (01:34 PM) ann_87: just noting what i think T would call it , and what T would do.... I would not sell it myself there for many reasons....but she has a VERY TIGHT stop on that 5 min trade, (01:35 PM) BrainStorm: I get a members only on that link and no obvious way to join...what is the group name ? (01:35 PM) dbphoenix: True, jimmer. Jargon sure helps cut down on typing, but it only works if there's general agreement on definitions. (01:36 PM) dbphoenix: There should be a link in the upper right-hand corner that says "Join This Group". (01:37 PM) BrainStorm: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ispec no dont get a join this group link (01:38 PM) dbphoenix: Category is Online Investing and Trading. Group name is ispec. (01:39 PM) ann_87: yes DB agree about using same words to mean same things (01:39 PM) BrainStorm: thanks (01:39 PM) dbphoenix: Make sure you're looking at Yahoo Groups, not Yahoo Clubs. (01:40 PM) dbphoenix: It's difficult with 2Bs, though, Ann, because different people will have different definitions of "failure" depending on risk tolerance. (01:41 PM) ann_87: true, but we should sort of all try to have same idea of what teresa has as a 2b and what retro has as a 2b (01:41 PM) dbphoenix: It's pretty easy to discriminate when there's energy. But when it grinds like this, it's easy to get stopped out in the chop. So it all winds up being moot. (01:45 PM) dbphoenix: Again, I can't speak for her, but using the 5m, the last pullback low is 1292. Therefore, the current test would not be a 2B until price dropped below 1292. However, if one were looking to short a potential 2B, he'd be stalking those 5m bars and set his sellstop below the most recent bar if it weren't a doji. (01:47 PM) ann_87: i am not sure db, but 2b's are on different time frames.... this might be a 2 min 2b (01:47 PM) ann_87: but for me not a 5min 2b (01:47 PM) dbphoenix: The problem with that is that without a confirmed 2B, you wind up stalking upbars in an uptrend, i.e., trying to short an uptrend. It makes more sense to see the failure, then begin stalking upbars, not stalk them all the way up to the HOD. (01:48 PM) dbphoenix: And if you don't get a lower high, you're still in an uptrend, 2B or no 2B. (01:49 PM) ppusa: HOD?? (01:49 PM) ann_87: yes you have to look for different types of confirmation.... her 2b if it is one is the 20 ema of that time frame 2b is on...and that could then be your buy area (01:49 PM) ann_87: the 20 ema that is (01:49 PM) ann_87: or the lower end of box (01:49 PM) dbphoenix: Yeah. That's what I got. (01:49 PM) BrainStorm: certainly a high ppusa (01:50 PM) BrainStorm: I still could get in...says by invitation only :-( (01:50 PM) dbphoenix: She'd anticipate buyers there who might drive the price back to a newer high, which is why she keeps her stops so tight until the new trend establishes itself. (01:50 PM) ann_87: db it is just also something to just be aware of to also know you expect a pull back to buy..... 2b's are different than 1 2 3 's (01:51 PM) dbphoenix: True. (01:51 PM) dbphoenix: You can have a 2B well before the trendline is broken. (01:51 PM) BrainStorm: going up but in a most unpleasant sort of way (01:51 PM) ann_87: i had a trendline broken (01:52 PM) ann_87: retro definitely has 2b's without trendlines broken (01:53 PM) ann_87: and yes db...that's true.... it is in trader vic's book i think pg 70.... or so intermediate 2b i think (01:54 PM) dbphoenix: Notice we had a "potential" 2B on the 1m at around 1335. When it pulled back, it didn't drop below either the last pullback low or the 20p (or at least not by much). Therefore, it went right back up to a new high ten minutes later. (01:55 PM) ann_87: after 10 am, i don't know anyone that trades 2b's on 1 min (01:55 PM) ann_87: as not reliable by any means (01:55 PM) dbphoenix: I sure wouldn't. But I watch them to see if they roll. (01:55 PM) ppusa: could be the big sneeze (01:55 PM) dbphoenix: For instance, the 5m may be presenting a graille buy. (01:56 PM) dbphoenix: But the expansion bars on the 1 and 3 are definitely on the negative side. (01:57 PM) dbphoenix: Sure makes a discretionary system difficult. (01:57 PM) jimbo_320: anyone short? (01:57 PM) ann_87: 1300 good round number Paltalk: To visit our sponsors, click on banners! (01:59 PM) dbphoenix: Not yet, jimbo. I'd rather see a real test of the high. (01:59 PM) ann_87: not short jimbo (01:59 PM) dbphoenix: Which means I'll miss it if there's a clunk. (01:59 PM) jimbo_320: 79.5 (01:59 PM) ann_87: hard withthe trin so low, i don't see selling pressure (01:59 PM) QSuzy: jimbo.....took a couple points only......gets a bit hairy at the top of the hour so I got out.... (02:01 PM) BrainStorm: if this little pullback turns down I will be (02:01 PM) jimbo_320: hoped we pass though 77 but didnt (02:02 PM) jimbo_320: there is big 2B on the dow 5 min (02:06 PM) dbphoenix: 2Bs on the NQ 1, 3, and 5 also, but no clunk. (02:07 PM) jimmer49: macd conservative buy on nq 5min (02:08 PM) dbphoenix: You may be right, jimmer. There's sure no selling pressure. (02:08 PM) dbphoenix: At least not yet. (02:08 PM) jimmer49: not taking it though (02:08 PM) BrainStorm: I got a sell stop at 1289.5 might pull it (02:09 PM) dbphoenix: Would retro go long or add or whatever at 1300? (02:10 PM) jimbo_320: gave some back :-) (02:10 PM) skyprince_1: db--rule says yes, but 10/8 HOD at 1304.5 will be resistance me thinks... (02:10 PM) dbphoenix: Dunno, sky. Whenever I anticipate resistance, I wind up being left behind. (02:11 PM) dbphoenix: I nearly always would have been better off stalking the bars the way I'm supposed to and letting resistance take care of itself. (02:12 PM) BrainStorm: pulled sell up .5 (02:12 PM) skyprince_1: Yeah...undertsand your point...but I think buy at 1305 is less risky...if it gets there. (02:12 PM) dragonfly_37: divergence on quote.com ...macd hist (02:12 PM) dbphoenix: Now will we make a higher low? (02:13 PM) jimbo_320: now it can clunk (02:13 PM) dbphoenix: Agree, sky. But sometimes there's just no entry after the breakout. (02:14 PM) dbphoenix: Lower low. #$*@)* (02:14 PM) jimbo_320: 5 retests (02:14 PM) dbphoenix: Should have gone to the damn zoo today. (02:14 PM) ppusa: POsSIBLE 25 point drop from here no guarantee (02:15 PM) jimmer49: today much more difficult than yesterday imo (02:15 PM) ppusa: thing is if get 25 point drop today think maybe HOW (02:15 PM) ppusa: 15 point drop due regardless (02:15 PM) ppusa: almost there (02:16 PM) dbphoenix: So much for the MACD signal. Another belief crushed :0( (02:16 PM) jimmer49: You need to ring a bell when that 15 point drop is about to begin - lol (02:17 PM) dbphoenix: Yes, please. (02:17 PM) jimbo_320: chop (02:17 PM) jimmer49: db - it is still one of the better patterns imo. (02:17 PM) dbphoenix: Seems to be. I'd like a guarantee, though, please. (02:18 PM) jimmer49: Time of day and overall circumstances made me skeptical of this one (02:18 PM) dbphoenix: That was a joke. (02:18 PM) dbphoenix: I've noticed that. (02:18 PM) jimmer49: If it is any help there was just a cons macd sell on 1 min which was successful (02:19 PM) ann_87: pulled back to 10:30 am high (02:20 PM) ann_87: trin still low .52 (02:20 PM) BrainStorm: glad I just took a scalp this dosent look like the big drop off (02:20 PM) jimmer49: and also, macd buy on 5 min may yet work on a second try (02:21 PM) ppusa: daily patterns on Dow and SP say no shorting until break today's low. Seems unlikely to happen as outside up day. (02:21 PM) ppusa: been shorting a bit but definately against trend (02:21 PM) BrainStorm: yeah the trend is long in my timeframes (02:22 PM) BrainStorm: except perhaps 1 min (02:22 PM) ann_87: IB 5 mn nq (02:22 PM) ppusa: would love to see this as a fakey and high of the wek but that would be presumptuous (02:22 PM) BrainStorm: 5 looks like it night have turned over too (02:22 PM) jimmer49: all day I have considered trade after trade and passed. just can't get the feling that the odds are good enough. (02:22 PM) jimmer49: feeling (02:23 PM) BrainStorm: have to say well done jimmer (02:23 PM) ann_87: sell divergence on 15 min can take us to 82 (02:23 PM) jimmer49: God, what has it come to? A compliment for doing nothing. (02:25 PM) ann_87: maybe the es and dow will have have good support at 15 ema with grail buys there and mike macd buy? (02:26 PM) BrainStorm: well I missed the morning move as there wasnt a good entry (for me) on the nas. then got chopped around a bit' (02:26 PM) ppusa: 15 and 16 reversing here (02:26 PM) BrainStorm: but should have been standing aside really (02:27 PM) ppusa: 25 to go (02:27 PM) ppusa: is not overextended (02:27 PM) dbphoenix: Dave was correct about the 2B at the open. I just wasn't looking at that. (02:28 PM) ppusa: would not short here looking for it, maybe a bounce (02:28 PM) Tom_B: pp, 70 ish supp ? (02:28 PM) ppusa: i havehere (02:28 PM) ppusa: unless the bottom drops out (02:28 PM) BrainStorm: jimbo you short ? Paltalk: Subscribe to Paltalk Plus to stop the popups today! Get it NOW for less than THREE CENTS a day! Click HELP on your Pal List then click 'Bannerless PalTalk'. (02:28 PM) ppusa: would not short here (02:29 PM) ppusa: if nothing else, due for bounce (02:29 PM) ann_87: nq got to 15 ema (02:29 PM) Tom_B: y, poss to sell into (02:29 PM) ppusa: still think lower but cannot justify the risk by entering here (02:29 PM) BrainStorm: nq down trend up to 5 min timeframe (02:30 PM) BrainStorm: 15 min I guess is debtable (02:30 PM) ann_87: dow and sp have 15 min grail buys... would be very very hard to short here... (02:30 PM) jimmer49: Here is how you could have made money today after the 1st hour - One min chart use stochastic 5,3,3 and buy as soon as it goes below 20 (no waiting for any other signal) and sell if oes over 80. Use 2.5 point stop. Would have worked 75% of time. No, I didn't do it. (02:30 PM) BrainStorm: grail buy is of retracement ? (02:31 PM) ppusa: new hour (02:31 PM) BrainStorm: Stocchs are great in these chop chop periods (02:31 PM) dbphoenix: Yes, BS, though there are several conditions. (02:31 PM) ppusa: think take out low last hour = secret chart (02:31 PM) Tom_B: selling time ? (02:31 PM) ann_87: grail buy is when you have had a very strong trend...strong enough to make the adx above 30 on that time frame (02:32 PM) BrainStorm: then buy retracement that turns back up ? (02:32 PM) ann_87: LBR buys the 20 ema usually (02:32 PM) BrainStorm: ahh OK which the 15 min may well bounce off right now (02:32 PM) dbphoenix: Depends on the number of bars and how they look yada yada. (02:33 PM) dbphoenix: There's also an article on that at the website link I gave you. (02:33 PM) dbphoenix: Called "The Holy Grail". (02:33 PM) ann_87: lbr is long right now (02:33 PM) BrainStorm: cant get in says by invite :-( (02:33 PM) BrainStorm: the way dave describes 2b we just made a top on the nas 15min ? (02:34 PM) dbphoenix: email T and ask if you can have access. (02:34 PM) BrainStorm: I shall (02:35 PM) perltrader: anyone trading bonds? (02:39 PM) jimbo_320: quitting for today, bye all (02:40 PM) skyprince_1: Bye jimbo (02:40 PM) ppusa: think high in this hour (02:41 PM) ppusa: hard to tell (02:41 PM) ppusa: if not new highs before end of day (02:43 PM) ppusa: #%$#%^%$$%^ (02:43 PM) BrainStorm: tend to agre we are going up (02:45 PM) ppusa: 5 up hours could take out previous hours low but iffy call as last pullback hit good support (02:45 PM) BrainStorm: just wish it wasnt so choppy (02:47 PM) dbphoenix: I've been entering orders with wider stops, but cancelling the orders if they go against me before the order is filled. With all this chop, net result has been zip, though I haven't lost anything. (02:48 PM) skyprince_1: Retro is losing this AM's gains...standing aside... (02:50 PM) BrainStorm: need to enter on the turns I think (02:51 PM) dbphoenix: Unfortunately, the turns often turn out not to be. (02:51 PM) BrainStorm: true (02:52 PM) BrainStorm: 75 tick looks quite usefulll dont trade of it but seems clearer (02:52 PM) BrainStorm: another bo up but turns straight away (02:53 PM) BrainStorm: better to take the trade of the bottom channel I'm guessing (02:53 PM) dbphoenix: The 15m is probably the best-looking chart. But those 5-pt stops can kill you on a 15m chart. (02:54 PM) BrainStorm: yes been there done that (02:54 PM) ann_87: true db, sometimes good to see 15 min good chart and look on 5 min for a good entry where can risk 5 (02:54 PM) BrainStorm: 5 min is a disaster zone today hehe (02:54 PM) ann_87: atleast in today's action it seems less risky (02:55 PM) dbphoenix: That's why I went to 10. I don't move it up to 5 until the order is actually filled and going my way. (02:56 PM) ann_87: the trin has been great clue today of trend day (02:57 PM) ann_87: dow 9200 (02:57 PM) dbphoenix: Today's been a good argument for retro. Just get in when you're supposed to and leave it the hell alone. (02:57 PM) BrainStorm: hasnt retro been chopped up after the morning run ? Paltalk: Please visit our advertisers by clicking on banners. (02:58 PM) dbphoenix: I'm not familiar with the sell rules. I like to place my stops at each successive reaction low. (02:59 PM) skyprince_1: db...what? Retro has given up 8 pts in last hour! (02:59 PM) dbphoenix: But if you were in at 1250, who cares? (03:00 PM) skyprince_1: That's not retro then...it is something else... (03:00 PM) dbphoenix: Give me 50 pts and I'll be more than happy to give you 8. (03:00 PM) dbphoenix: 1250 was the top of the first bar. (03:01 PM) BrainStorm: going nicely now (03:02 PM) skyprince_1: db...you're using different "exit" rules then. (03:02 PM) BrainStorm: getting ready to test the HoD (03:03 PM) dbphoenix: Perhaps. But I understood that all this was still under construction. (03:04 PM) ann_87: db certain rules people are following (03:04 PM) ann_87: and trailing stops i think is one of them (03:05 PM) ann_87: depending on where one is on 5 min (03:05 PM) BrainStorm: there she blows (03:05 PM) dbphoenix: Using the last reaction high/low is also a trailing stop. You're just not trailing bar by bar. (03:06 PM) ann_87: db , you don't need any of retro to do that (03:06 PM) ann_87: imho (03:06 PM) dbphoenix: I guess somebody has already pointed out that we're at swing highs in all the major averages. (03:06 PM) skyprince_1: Those are some wide stops... (03:07 PM) BrainStorm: last reaction works well on strong trend days it can get left behind but not such a problem on a strong trend day (03:07 PM) dbphoenix: But they keep you in unless there's a good reason to be out. (03:07 PM) QSuzy: Does anyone know what Howard decided to cover in Ensign session this afternoon? (03:07 PM) BrainStorm: is that your favoured stop db ? (03:08 PM) BrainStorm: nas catching the s&p (03:08 PM) dbphoenix: On the initial entry, I use points or percentage. But once it's begun to move, I use last reaction. It's either that or the bottom of the previous bar, but I've found the latter to be much too tight. (03:09 PM) dbphoenix: Or top of the previous bar, depending on whether you're long or short. (03:09 PM) BrainStorm: I have much more trouble with initial stops (03:09 PM) BrainStorm: works for me (03:10 PM) dbphoenix: Initial stops are a problem. I've never liked percentages much, tho a lot of people think they're just great. (03:12 PM) BrainStorm: have to take into account range or you get hit all the time (03:13 PM) BrainStorm: nice move (03:14 PM) dbphoenix: If this keeps up, tho, you may wind up having to go to a 10 or 15m chart just to get away from the noise. (03:16 PM) BrainStorm: yes I was figuring that but that changes the whole risk reward thing you still have to keep your stops out of range of the noise (03:19 PM) dbphoenix: Noise make r:r pretty much moot. Doesn't help to define risk with tight stops if the stops keep getting hit. That's as good a way to deplete a trading account as any. (03:20 PM) ann_87: 3 pushes up on the 15 min (03:24 PM) skyprince_1: Retro seems to suffer about 50% losses...but all in the 3 to 5 pt range...and 50% wins are in the 3 to 20 pt range. No brainer really...if you stick to it RELIGIOUSLY. The real battle is from within. (03:25 PM) ann_87: nq trin .30 (03:26 PM) dbphoenix: It's difficult to stick religiously to something that's still a work in progress, though. (03:27 PM) skyprince_1: yes... Paltalk: Your friends are just a click away! Press the invite button NOW! (03:31 PM) dbphoenix: Using the last reaction high/low has been a good compromise between gettting out too soon and not getting out soon enough. Percentages and points and Dunnigan haven't worked well for me. (03:35 PM) jimmer49: Hey db - you know that last macd cons buy on 5 min that appeared to fail? Just shift slightly higher in time frame to 7 min and look what happened. A very nice one. (03:38 PM) dbphoenix: I always wonder if I'm just looking for what I want to see when I do that. Nice graille buy on the 15m, tho. (03:41 PM) ann_87: db on 15 min es and dow was a nice macd first cross buy too (03:46 PM) dbphoenix: Like jimmer said earlier, tho, it's probably not a good idea to make too much of these this late in the day. It isn't as if anybody's gotten rich off the signal. (03:47 PM) dbphoenix: I'm not doing a very good job of analyzing the very-early morning setups. That's whay I have to work on. (03:47 PM) dbphoenix: whay=what (03:48 PM) ann_87: some people make there money on that pattern... people that specialize in trend days (03:49 PM) dbphoenix: I suspect they're more likely to make decent money on morning signals than late afternoon signals, though. Or maybe not. (03:50 PM) ann_87: well, lbr on trend days... buys the wave in afternoon too when institutions come back from lunch (03:50 PM) dbphoenix: Unfortunately, I'm not LBR :0) (03:51 PM) ann_87: if they are good buyers in morning then she looks to also do a buy in afternoon (03:51 PM) jimmer49: Back before 9/11 we went thru a couple of weeks when the best signals of the day came during the noon hour. But nothing ever stays the same. Otherwise it would be too easy. (03:51 PM) ann_87: just trying to say, that if one did hte move in morning....there could possibly be a set up ...as the 15 min grail buy to make money on in the afternoon (03:52 PM) dbphoenix: True, jimmer. You have to adapt. (03:52 PM) ann_87: sorry meant to say if one did miss the move (03:54 PM) Tom_B: pp, u still trading / (03:54 PM) ppusa: y Paltalk: Go bannerless and support PalTalk! Subscribe today! Only $9.95 a year! Click HELP on your Pal List then click 'Bannerless PalTalk'. (04:00 PM) Tarponmandan: SEVU - check it out! (04:00 PM) ppusa: if nq opens lower tomorrow and starts higher, i am buying (04:10 PM) Graham GoldNow: Hey guys, I gotta admit do futures scares the pants offa me! (04:10 PM) Graham GoldNow: ...and thats not a pretty site! Paltalk: Please support our sponsors by clicking on banners. (04:36 PM) TTKingfish: Steggy room is giving a prop trader demo.....who ever is interested (04:37 PM) scottybythelake: thx fish (04:37 PM) scottybythelake: ??? (04:46 PM) alcapone101: everybody plzz visit rhis breakthrough site:http://proliferator.com/5dollarpro.php?id=love (04:51 PM) Tom_B: k Paltalk: Are banners a bummer and popups a pain? Cure your banner blues NOW for $9.95 a year! Click HELP on your Pal List then select Bannerless PalTalk to subscribe now! No banners! No Popups! Fast video in all groups! (04:59 PM) alcapone101: click to visit the dynamite site:http://proliferator.com/5dollarpro.php?id=love (05:05 PM) Tom_B: y (05:28 PM) Tom_B: ? Paltalk: Multivideo has been activated in all Paltalk groups!!! With Paltalk 4.0 (available from our beta link on our homepage), you can see up to three people in every group. Paltalk Plus subscribers can see people in full motion video. (05:33 PM) Tom_B: same as mine (05:35 PM) ppusa: hold mouse button down and drag range downward (05:44 PM) Tom_B: no audio (05:48 PM) Roger Schelling: i posted the 15 point (05:57 PM) ppusa: 72 point range today Paltalk: Click banners to visit our sponsors. (06:00 PM) ppusa: higher high tonight (06:01 PM) ppusa: u mean es 'cos nq higher high (06:02 PM) ppusa: no (06:02 PM) ppusa: still ovesold? (06:05 PM) ann_87: hi ppusa , can you post a chart of your pp 1 2 3 example of today? (06:06 PM) Tom_B: no audio (06:07 PM) ann_87: tom is someone speaking? (06:07 PM) ppusa: yes (06:07 PM) ppusa: Ann it was me (06:08 PM) ppusa: can you hear (06:08 PM) ppusa: ann (06:08 PM) ann_87: no i can't (06:08 PM) ppusa: log out and back in (06:08 PM) ppusa: if you have speakers (06:08 PM) ann_87: mine usually works.... (06:08 PM) ann_87: tom can't hear you and i can't either (06:08 PM) ppusa: so try log off and back (06:08 PM) Tom_B: pal tk idiosync (06:08 PM) ann_87: can you speak once more? (06:08 PM) ppusa: tom hears (06:09 PM) ppusa: did you see mic? (06:09 PM) ann_87: he said no audio (06:09 PM) ann_87: yea (06:09 PM) bethcut: yes and heard you too (06:10 PM) bethcut: could others see the post too? (06:10 PM) ann_87: pp can you post a chart of your 1 2 3 please (06:10 PM) ppusa: ann can you go to dacharts_dachart_dacharts_dachart and look at Roger's post (06:10 PM) ann_87: sure (06:11 PM) ppusa: no (06:12 PM) ann_87: no what pp? (06:13 PM) Roger Schelling: http://www.dacharts_dachart_dacharts_dachart.com/charts/2001-10-10/RogerS4.gif (06:13 PM) ppusa: ann canyou hear? (06:13 PM) ann_87: no lol (06:13 PM) ppusa: splains that (06:13 PM) Just1BadGirl: is this a self-help group for people addicted to e-trading? (06:14 PM) Tom_B: hve u exited & returned ? (06:14 PM) ppusa: no referred to something else (06:14 PM) ann_87: i willl exit (06:14 PM) Tom_B: k (06:14 PM) ppusa: no bad girl (06:14 PM) ppusa: it is a help group for traders (06:14 PM) bethcut: is it the pyrapoint on the directory of chart? (06:14 PM) marc00_1: well badgirl but maybe we could start a room for that? (06:14 PM) Just1BadGirl: then what is the Anonymous part? (06:15 PM) ppusa: cos you don't know who we are (06:15 PM) ppusa: but we all want to meet you (06:15 PM) ann_87: ok can i have a sound check pls. (06:15 PM) Just1BadGirl: oh, I thought perhaps this was like Alcoholics Anonymous... (06:16 PM) Roger Schelling: can u hear ppusa? (06:16 PM) ppusa: no bad girl (06:16 PM) Roger Schelling: ann? (06:16 PM) ppusa: ann can u hear (06:16 PM) ppusa: ann (06:16 PM) Roger Schelling: ann, can u hear ppusa ? (06:16 PM) ppusa: ANN (06:16 PM) ann_87: no roger i can't (06:16 PM) ann_87: it is also not showing me a mike in front of anyone's name (06:16 PM) ppusa: ANN (06:16 PM) ann_87: to even show that someone is speaking (06:16 PM) ann_87: lol (06:16 PM) Tom_B: strange (06:16 PM) Roger Schelling: can u hear me when i speak ? (06:16 PM) ppusa: see mic (06:17 PM) ppusa: whatever (06:17 PM) ppusa: look at post (06:17 PM) ann_87: sorry i hear nothing (06:17 PM) ppusa: go to post (06:17 PM) Tom_B: dann, did u do complete xit from PT ? (06:17 PM) ann_87: ok (06:17 PM) Roger Schelling: only fix i know of for sound is to exit the room and reenter (06:17 PM) Tom_B: ann (06:17 PM) ppusa: see 1-2-3 off first pullback low (06:17 PM) ann_87: which chart of roger's? (06:17 PM) ppusa: yes (06:18 PM) Roger Schelling: RogerS4.gif (06:18 PM) ppusa: y (06:18 PM) bethcut: where can we view the charts? (06:18 PM) ann_87: so you are referring to a pp 1 2 3 ? (06:18 PM) ppusa: dacharts_dachart_dacharts_dachart.com (06:18 PM) bethcut: here (06:18 PM) ann_87: and what time? (06:18 PM) ppusa: yes (06:18 PM) Tom_B: www.dacharts_dachart_dacharts_dachart.com (06:18 PM) Roger Schelling: http://www.dacharts_dachart_dacharts_dachart.com/charts/2001-10-10 (06:19 PM) ann_87: roger is this a 5 min chart? (06:19 PM) ppusa: 15 minute (06:19 PM) ann_87: k (06:19 PM) ann_87: what time pp was the 1 2 3 (06:19 PM) ppusa: start with low 1275 area (06:19 PM) ppusa: see it? (06:19 PM) ppusa: 10:15 (06:20 PM) Roger Schelling: undersatand my chart times are central time (06:20 PM) bethcut: thank you, now seeing what you are seeing (06:20 PM) ann_87: i think so (06:20 PM) ann_87: oh ok lol (06:20 PM) ppusa: well u c low at 10:15 right? (06:20 PM) ann_87: 10'15 on his chart though right? (06:20 PM) ann_87: yes pp (06:21 PM) ppusa: okay go to next highest high without a down bar (06:21 PM) ann_87: around 11:15? (06:21 PM) ppusa: 11:00 (06:21 PM) rjh_1: should have bought mini @ 9:30 @ 1060 (06:21 PM) ppusa: yes (06:22 PM) ppusa: low of down bar 1277 was the "2" (06:22 PM) ppusa: 3 was move to next highest up bar without a down bar inbetween (06:23 PM) ppusa: the thing is this example is not a good one because the trend was working (06:23 PM) ppusa: IN CHOP IN CHOP IN CHOP...15 minute gets 1-2-3 (06:24 PM) ppusa: and this is what i refer to as 1-2-3 ...but this is more like triangle break followed by up (06:24 PM) Tom_B: pp, are u scalping around this during the session ? (06:24 PM) ppusa: wish u hadn't asked thatone (06:24 PM) ann_87: what is your obj of your 1 2 3 ? (06:25 PM) ppusa: the 3 (06:25 PM) Tom_B: nvr mind :) (06:25 PM) ppusa: today as i said was buy and hold day (06:25 PM) ppusa: said it before open, say it again (06:25 PM) ann_87: wish every day was a trend day so nice (06:25 PM) ppusa: do as i say, not as i do (06:26 PM) ann_87: monday and tuesday were not fun (06:26 PM) Tom_B: y ? (06:26 PM) ppusa: ann speaking now (06:27 PM) ann_87: sorry, i will go... (06:27 PM) ann_87: i can't hear anything (06:27 PM) ppusa: log completly out (06:27 PM) ann_87: i did and will do one more time (06:28 PM) Tom_B: reboot Paltalk: Love PalTalk but hate the banners and popups? Go bannerless! Only $9.95 per year! Click HELP on your Pal List then click 'Bannerless PalTalk'. (06:31 PM) Roger Schelling: ann, is your question, Identifying 123 and what is the purpose of identifying them ? (06:33 PM) ann_87: narrow ranges lead to trend days (06:33 PM) ann_87: es had 2 nr 7's in a row (06:33 PM) Roger Schelling: yes, i agree ann (06:33 PM) ppusa: Ann can u hearnow (06:33 PM) ann_87: yes!! wow , (06:33 PM) ppusa: great (06:33 PM) ann_87: i forgot i just got a router (06:34 PM) ann_87: and i did not have the firewall thing check marked (06:34 PM) ppusa: nope (06:35 PM) ann_87: nr is narrow range (06:35 PM) ann_87: narrowest range of last 7 days (06:35 PM) ann_87: we had 2 in a row (06:36 PM) ann_87: she trades then a break out (06:36 PM) ann_87: THE TRIN (06:36 PM) ann_87: hey i noticed the trin! (06:36 PM) ann_87: that was a great clue (06:36 PM) ppusa: even the tick narrowed (06:37 PM) minnie_142: 2 B's (06:38 PM) ann_87: lbr says after these narrow ranges we will be in break out mode... never know what direction...take clues from market (06:38 PM) ann_87: with ticks and trin (06:39 PM) ann_87: a 1 2 3 like trader vic (06:39 PM) ann_87: she is also very much into volume (06:39 PM) ann_87: i.e. on this day we had high tick readings .....show instiutions buying (06:41 PM) ann_87: ok, (06:41 PM) ann_87: i will try to notice them (06:41 PM) ann_87: between 10 and 10:30 (06:41 PM) ann_87: big ticks and she says that is instituions buying they buy before lunch and then after.... as long as you see trin still low... .50 (06:42 PM) ann_87: pp. are you asking re : tomorrow re : nr 7;s? (06:42 PM) ann_87: lbr would say , just some follow thru but bullets used up on trend days (06:43 PM) ann_87: tomorrow could be a consolidation day (06:44 PM) ann_87: we should see follow thru (06:44 PM) ann_87: linda ratschke (06:44 PM) ann_87: most of the big move (06:44 PM) ann_87: yes (06:44 PM) ann_87: lol (06:45 PM) ann_87: thank you (06:45 PM) bethcut: thank you for sharing with us (06:45 PM) Roger Schelling: i9 posted the daily ES fo (06:45 PM) Gene417: I would like to invite you into the Emini S&P Bandtraders room (06:45 PM) Roger Schelling: yes thx for the discussion (06:46 PM) ann_87: pp do you ever use the trin? (06:46 PM) ppusa: no Ann (06:46 PM) ann_87: i only wish i did not trade that chop of monday and tuesday (06:47 PM) ann_87: pp it can be good on certain times like today....not every day...but on days where you are expecting what you expected (06:49 PM) Roger Schelling: yes me too (06:49 PM) ppusa: SHSHSHSAnn is about to speak (06:49 PM) Roger Schelling: ann no sound :) (06:49 PM) ann_87: i guess no sound when i speak (06:49 PM) ann_87: hmm (06:50 PM) ppusa: maybe mic plugged in wrong (06:50 PM) ppusa: hahaha (06:50 PM) Roger Schelling: YES! (06:50 PM) ppusa: shock (06:50 PM) ppusa: no (06:50 PM) bethcut: Hello Ann (06:50 PM) ppusa: noise in back ground (06:50 PM) ppusa: yes 2b break (06:51 PM) ann_87: bye all (06:52 PM) ann_87: thanks all (06:52 PM) Roger Schelling: good discussion, AH (06:52 PM) ppusa: no (06:52 PM) ann_87: lol (06:52 PM) ppusa: oh ok (06:55 PM) Roger Schelling: adv issues-dec issues / adv volume - dec vilume (06:59 PM) Orprepus: whats the topic this afternoon (06:59 PM) minnie_142: inverse relation with price Paltalk: Please support our sponsors by clicking on banners. (07:00 PM) Orprepus: trin or trend (07:01 PM) ann_87: trend of trin is also important (07:02 PM) Orprepus: heres a good sit (07:02 PM) Orprepus: http://search.atomz.com/search/?actionDD=Site+Search%3A&sp-q=TRIN&sp-a=00010a6e-sp00000000&Go%21.x=27&Go%21.y=10 (07:02 PM) ppusa: just chatting about differnet things Orp (07:02 PM) Orprepus: ok inverted trin on tick chart (07:02 PM) ann_87: ok well good chatting see you all tomorrow! (07:02 PM) Orprepus: magic number for trin is? (07:03 PM) Orprepus: ONE (07:03 PM) Orprepus: see ya ann (07:03 PM) Tom_B: bye (07:03 PM) Orprepus: so why they rally today? (07:04 PM) ppusa: perfect triangle intraday hour chart (07:04 PM) Orprepus: lol (07:04 PM) Orprepus: looking at monthly chart with 200 & 400 SMA (07:05 PM) Orprepus: sept. 21 touch 400ma for sirst time since (07:05 PM) Orprepus: dec 1991 (07:06 PM) ppusa: downside? (07:06 PM) Orprepus: wow (07:06 PM) ppusa: your quotes or somewhere else (07:06 PM) Orprepus: no on the rise but turning (07:07 PM) Orprepus: on my chart (07:07 PM) Orprepus: should be able to see it on www.bigcharts.com (07:07 PM) Orprepus: just looking big picture do it every night - keeps me ground on where we are at (07:08 PM) Orprepus: great big HS formation (07:08 PM) Orprepus: roger still around (07:09 PM) ppusa: says so (07:09 PM) ppusa: ray (07:09 PM) ppusa: me (07:09 PM) Orprepus: lol (07:09 PM) Roger Schelling: yes (07:10 PM) Orprepus: remember HS chart (07:10 PM) Orprepus: big timeframe (07:10 PM) Roger Schelling: on spx yes (07:10 PM) Roger Schelling: it's posted (07:10 PM) Orprepus: yes (07:11 PM) Orprepus: thats the one - just like looking at everynight - reminds me wher we are at (07:11 PM) Roger Schelling: posted by ORP on 10/08 (07:12 PM) Orprepus: did one for a daily today (07:13 PM) Roger Schelling: ? (07:13 PM) Roger Schelling: don't see it (07:13 PM) ppusa: so when will the high of this month bein so markets can sell off again? (07:14 PM) Orprepus: think this week (07:15 PM) ppusa: maybe tomorrow? (07:15 PM) ppusa: see if nq breaks high of last week (07:15 PM) ppusa: maybe Friday is low is in (07:15 PM) Orprepus: be nice for nq to close gap and than we turn back down (07:16 PM) Orprepus: Apr lows - now resistance (07:16 PM) ppusa: close meaning hit "close before break or just hit gap" (07:16 PM) ppusa: Dow futures traded in gap today (07:17 PM) ppusa: yes, i'm looking at that resis but so far hasn't turned markets back (07:17 PM) Orprepus: mean hit - we do not need to close above it (07:18 PM) Orprepus: rumor fed crash protection buying todayy (07:19 PM) Orprepus: Roger look now (07:19 PM) Orprepus: it is big (07:19 PM) ppusa: okay i updated nq daily chart...5 points away from trading in gap (07:19 PM) Orprepus: didn't go (07:20 PM) Orprepus: be great if it close over night (07:20 PM) ppusa: i sold 2 nq but covered figuring have chance tomorrow (07:21 PM) Orprepus: roger don't know what it is having trouble posting (07:21 PM) Orprepus: maybe too big (07:21 PM) Roger Schelling: s'ok seems others were having probs with ensign posting also (07:21 PM) ppusa: shows up but cannot see it (07:21 PM) ppusa: brb (07:22 PM) Orprepus: ok (07:23 PM) Orprepus: going to post Tick with trin overlay maybe that will work (07:23 PM) Orprepus: SPX cahrt too big (07:24 PM) Roger Schelling: must be TICK overlay that came thru on the chart (07:26 PM) Orprepus: yes that is what work - small chart (07:26 PM) Orprepus: yes SPX daily is big I guess (07:28 PM) Roger Schelling: posted SPX daily (07:28 PM) Roger Schelling: Basic chart Paltalk: Press the INVITE button NOW! Get your friends in on the fun! Invite them to join us on PalTalk today! (07:30 PM) Orprepus: see it (07:31 PM) Orprepus: left shoulder - Jan 98 to 1098 (07:31 PM) Orprepus: you know where the head is (07:32 PM) Roger Schelling: yes (07:32 PM) Orprepus: should forming now with sept 21 low (07:34 PM) Roger Schelling: yes (07:34 PM) Roger Schelling: hi (07:35 PM) Orprepus: motorola - laysoff 7000 - announce lower earnings and stock went up today - go figure (07:36 PM) Buffy_04364: isn't that a sign of the bottom orp? (07:36 PM) Buffy_04364: :-) (07:36 PM) Orprepus: yes the bottom to come (07:37 PM) Stroman: hi (07:37 PM) Stroman: http://angelsempor.themostgifts.com/angelsempor/ (07:37 PM) Buffy_04364: guess you figured out you can't use a ? in the title of charts to be posted? (07:37 PM) Orprepus: no I havent (07:37 PM) Orprepus: thank you (07:37 PM) Stroman: hi all (07:37 PM) Stroman: http://angelsempor.themostgifts.com/angelsempor/ (07:37 PM) Orprepus: did not know why (07:37 PM) Orprepus: thought it was to big (07:38 PM) Buffy_04364: now you do :-) (07:38 PM) Buffy_04364: few other symbols it doesn't like too (07:38 PM) Orprepus: will try again - thank you buffy you the best (07:38 PM) Buffy_04364: :-) (07:38 PM) Roger Schelling: ORP these sector people , expect to see industrial's last weak numbers come in after the market bottoms. FWIW (07:39 PM) Roger Schelling: http://www.stockcharts.com/charts/performance/SPSectors.html#top (07:39 PM) Buffy_04364: I have missed you guys also (07:39 PM) Roger Schelling: yea , get your self back in here! (07:39 PM) Orprepus: been having fun with your brother (07:39 PM) Orprepus: it is good to take a break everynow and than (07:40 PM) Orprepus: we missed you also - I know howard wonder what was going on - very few charts posted (07:40 PM) ppusa: Question, did you get your S$P chart to post. I didn't see one come through? (07:41 PM) Orprepus: finally did - buffy told me EW will not take "?" marks (07:41 PM) Orprepus: in title (07:41 PM) Orprepus: it is there now - just spx HS (07:42 PM) Roger Schelling: got it (07:42 PM) Orprepus: still need the "W" bottom (07:42 PM) ppusa: got it (07:42 PM) ppusa: What do you think the chances of markets taking out last months highs. (07:42 PM) Orprepus: hey look at the W back in 98 bottom (07:42 PM) ppusa: Looks so far like "V" bottom (07:42 PM) Orprepus: yes V (07:43 PM) Orprepus: 2001 mar/apr also w - very quick one (07:43 PM) Buffy_04364: Oh yes lots of fun with my brother (07:43 PM) ppusa: if markets get much higher than this, next resis isn't until much higher (07:43 PM) Buffy_04364: even turned the simulator over to him this morning LOL (07:43 PM) Buffy_04364: who knows (07:43 PM) ppusa: The stimulator? (07:44 PM) Buffy_04364: no pfg best trading platform simulator (07:44 PM) Orprepus: good - so when does he leave so we can get you back? (07:44 PM) Roger Schelling: posted , 1 scenario for "W" or "after sucessful 2B test" (07:44 PM) Buffy_04364: dusted it off showed him the charts and said go to it (07:44 PM) Buffy_04364: he has been in the markets longer than I but only does stocks at the present (07:45 PM) Buffy_04364: He leaves late tomorrow or early friday - don't know yet (07:45 PM) Buffy_04364: nice sp orp (07:46 PM) Orprepus: great - glad you got to spend time with your brother - those are the important things in life - family and friends (07:46 PM) Buffy_04364: lots of notes Roger (07:46 PM) Buffy_04364: yes orp they are (07:46 PM) Roger Schelling: yea that chart is too busy :) (07:46 PM) Buffy_04364: doesn't seem like we were apart for 4 years (07:47 PM) Buffy_04364: reading (07:47 PM) Buffy_04364: no I bet every note is needed roger (07:47 PM) Orprepus: thanks buffy (07:47 PM) Roger Schelling: but still gotta have those "fierce pullbacks that survive" (07:47 PM) Buffy_04364: art is watching the Velez video tape I have (07:47 PM) Buffy_04364: on Swing trading (07:48 PM) Buffy_04364: yes and I just love to jump the gun with them :-( (07:48 PM) Buffy_04364: getting much better though (07:48 PM) Orprepus: ppusa - might take out sept high - this week - but back down (07:49 PM) ppusa: one positive for higher is the low of this month was well defined. The other is the 50 and 200 day ma's are much higher and i think that is more real resistance. (07:50 PM) Buffy_04364: posted 4m pyra (07:50 PM) ppusa: would be nice to see another drop. would look good monthly (07:50 PM) Buffy_04364: for those that miss it (07:50 PM) Buffy_04364: whoops should do it in tomorrows folder (07:50 PM) Roger Schelling: i will post a Oil chart, they are doing that same "fierce pullbak" right now on the daily, and can't make new lows, (seems to me) (07:50 PM) Orprepus: would be orderly for bottom (07:52 PM) ppusa: i can see either way and in fact think right now kinda toppy short term. (07:52 PM) Roger Schelling: Posted SLB daily, just can't hack new lows right now (07:53 PM) Orprepus: see it roger (07:53 PM) Buffy_04364: posted a ticki also that shows lots of accumulation going on (07:53 PM) Roger Schelling: SLB , after 2B with thrust (07:53 PM) Orprepus: buffy where did you post them? (07:53 PM) ppusa: what is SLB? (07:53 PM) Orprepus: 10/10/2000? (07:54 PM) Roger Schelling: Schluberger, oil service leaer (07:54 PM) Orprepus: oops 2001-10-10 (07:54 PM) Roger Schelling: many in that group (07:54 PM) Orprepus: oh day of numbers (07:54 PM) ppusa: schlumberger (07:54 PM) Buffy_04364: I am putting mine in tomorrow's folder (07:54 PM) Orprepus: oh (07:55 PM) Roger Schelling: http://www.stockcharts.com/charts/performance/SPSectors.html#top (07:55 PM) Orprepus: scratching my head - going where are they (07:55 PM) Roger Schelling: SLB group charts (07:55 PM) Orprepus: thats ok buffy you are alwasy a day head of me or at least several time zones (07:56 PM) ppusa: see what tomorrow brings, bye for now (07:56 PM) Orprepus: see ya pp - have a good evening (07:56 PM) Orprepus: buffy - nice tiki chart (07:56 PM) ppusa: U2, bye Roger and Buffy (07:57 PM) Roger Schelling: c ya thx ppusa (07:57 PM) Buffy_04364: tks orp (07:57 PM) Buffy_04364: night pp (07:57 PM) Buffy_04364: been listening to you guys (07:57 PM) Buffy_04364: intrsting (07:58 PM) Orprepus: yeah we been forming a plan to take over the world like Pinky and the brain - oh course I am Pinky (08:00 PM) Orprepus: hey - had a bad EW day - sent problem to Howard - occasionally get the EW hang and my system hangs from repaint/redrawing screen (08:00 PM) Buffy_04364: lol (08:00 PM) Buffy_04364: that isn't nice orp (08:00 PM) Orprepus: know howard does not like the H word (08:00 PM) Buffy_04364: no he sure doesn't Paltalk: You DO have a choice! Buy bannerless to end your popup blues today! Click OPTIONS on your Pal List then click 'Bannerless PalTalk'. Only $9.95 a year! That's less than THREE CENTS per day! WOW!!! (08:00 PM) Buffy_04364: he is really working hard to get this stable so he can go and do a major project with it but no clue what it is (08:01 PM) Orprepus: wants to change language I think so that we can have more bars (08:01 PM) Buffy_04364: :-) (08:01 PM) Buffy_04364: well art roaming so bye for now (08:02 PM) Buffy_04364: enjoyed (08:02 PM) Orprepus: see ya have fun Paltalk: The CAVNET Survivors of Intimate Violence Forum is now open -- in Social Issues -- Discussing domestic violence, sexual violence, stalking and crime victims with disabilities. Paltalk: To visit our sponsors, click on banners! (08:49 PM) Buffy_04364: well guys he is back at the video (08:49 PM) Buffy_04364: How did retro do today? Paltalk: Subscribe to Paltalk Plus to stop the popups today! Get it NOW for less than THREE CENTS a day! Click HELP on your Pal List then click 'Bannerless PalTalk'. Paltalk: Please visit our advertisers by clicking on banners. Paltalk: The CAVNET Survivors of Intimate Violence Forum is now open -- in Social Issues -- Discussing domestic violence, sexual violence, stalking and crime victims with disabilities. (09:58 PM) hagen1: dave, you there ? Paltalk: Your friends are just a click away! Press the invite button NOW! (10:20 PM) ab_40: hi Paltalk: Go bannerless and support PalTalk! Subscribe today! Only $9.95 a year! Click HELP on your Pal List then click 'Bannerless PalTalk'. Paltalk: Please support our sponsors by clicking on banners. Paltalk: Are banners a bummer and popups a pain? Cure your banner blues NOW for $9.95 a year! Click HELP on your Pal List then select Bannerless PalTalk to subscribe now! No banners! No Popups! Fast video in all groups! Paltalk: Multivideo has been activated in all Paltalk groups!!! With Paltalk 4.0 (available from our beta link on our homepage), you can see up to three people in every group. Paltalk Plus subscribers can see people in full motion video. Paltalk: Click banners to visit our sponsors. Welcome Msg: Welcome index futures traders and TrendVUE.com alumni. Today's charts at www.DaCharts.com WARNING: Any trades posted here are for educational purposes only. Don't take the trades unless you understand them and can take the risk. Paltalk: Please support our sponsors by clicking on banners. (01:53 AM) tony_44_1: hey is anyone here Paltalk: Press the INVITE button NOW! Get your friends in on the fun! Invite them to join us on PalTalk today! Paltalk: You DO have a choice! Buy bannerless to end your popup blues today! Click OPTIONS on your Pal List then click 'Bannerless PalTalk'. Only $9.95 a year! That's less than THREE CENTS per day! WOW!!! Paltalk: To visit our sponsors, click on banners! Paltalk: Subscribe to Paltalk Plus to stop the popups today! Get it NOW for less than THREE CENTS a day! Click HELP on your Pal List then click 'Bannerless PalTalk'. Paltalk: Please visit our advertisers by clicking on banners. Paltalk: Your friends are just a click away! Press the invite button NOW! Paltalk: Go bannerless and support PalTalk! Subscribe today! Only $9.95 a year! Click HELP on your Pal List then click 'Bannerless PalTalk'. Paltalk: Please support our sponsors by clicking on banners. Paltalk: Are banners a bummer and popups a pain? Cure your banner blues NOW for $9.95 a year! Click HELP on your Pal List then select Bannerless PalTalk to subscribe now! No banners! No Popups! Fast video in all groups! Paltalk: Multivideo has been activated in all Paltalk groups!!! With Paltalk 4.0 (available from our beta link on our homepage), you can see up to three people in every group. Paltalk Plus subscribers can see people in full motion video. Paltalk: Click banners to visit our sponsors.